Jump to content


Photo

About Sexual Harassment


  • Please log in to reply
59 replies to this topic

#1 bethscott

bethscott
  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ca

Posted 20 November 2008 - 10:56 PM

I just want to share with you this incident that happened in our work few days ago. I will just not mention real names and places here for privacy purposes. A lady(alias Gina) from other country(Columbia) learned that somebody in the company she's working was spreading gossip about her...that she told her co-worker that her job when she was still in Columbia was to do "massage and blow job"!!!

Gina's friend(Sandra) was the one who told her about it because Sandra's step-son(Paul) is also working in that same company. Sandra said that her step-son Paul came to their house and asked his Dad and Sandra about Gina's work in Columbia. He said he asked about it cause he heard the gossip from work. So, Sandra informed Gina right away cause she wanted her friend to be aware of the gossip.

So, the following day, Gina asked Paul about it ....and he told her that it's true he heard about it but he just forgot who said it....but Gina didn't believe he forgot who started the gossip. And she wanted so bad to know who's the bottom of that issue cause it's a sexual harassment. Gina reported it to the HR but the HR Manager told her that he don't have ways to trace who really started the gossip..and he advice Gina to just let it go and stop opening the issue again. But Gina is not satisfied and I understand her side.

So, if you were Gina, what will be your reaction or what will you do?

Beth<img src="http://i238.photobuc...clemmns/hi.gif" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />

<a href="http://profiles.frie...r.com/user.php" target="_blank">http://profiles.frie...om/user.php</a>
<a href="http://www.facebook....ns?ref=profile" target="_blank">http://www.facebook....ref=profile</a>

Removing Conditions on Residence

Sept. 07, 2009 - Sent I-751 Application to VSC (Thru USPS Express Mail)
Sept. 17, 2009 - Received I-751 Receipt Notice
Sept. 25, 2009 - Received Biometrics Schedule
Oct. 17, 2009 - Biometrics done
Jan. 07, 2010 - Received RFE Notice
Feb. 03, 2010 - Submitted Additional Evidences
Feb. 26, 2010 - Card Production Notice

<img src="http://i238.photobuc...b3274581ca.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /><img src="http://i238.photobuc.../val2010-1.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />.

#2 zzzlpr

zzzlpr
  • Senior Member
  • 3,843 posts
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ve

Posted 20 November 2008 - 11:46 PM

What kind of business is that? That might be important.

I am 100% positive the HR Manager is trying to make it go away.
I bet his superior is on the look out.

This is what I would do. I am not telling her to do it. She might want to involve a lawyer from the beginning.
This is her decision.

I think this is too serious.
The guy who confirmed the gossip is the key.
Tell her to get a witness, someone that works there that she can trust.
Then go back with this person to talk with the guy who confirmed the gossip and make him confirm again.
If she has a witness from the first time and she can trust this person will confirm then is even better.

I would make a written complain to the HR and copy it to his superior and her supervisor.

I don't know how serious she is, i.e., if she up to take it to the end.
If she is, like Colombians are, she should mention, when giving the complaint to the HR that if this written complaint does not get the matter resolved. She will have no alternative than involving a lawyer.
The HR manager will freak out.

In the written complaint make sure to tell that the guy confirmed the gossip and the witness can confirm.

However, before the written complaint is filed, I would go back to the guy and say that he will be listed in the complaint and might have to take the heat.
Advise him that he should tell who started, and the written complaint will have him just as a witness.
I am positive he knows or he started himself.
If he knows, he likely will tell you who did it, and the complaint is complete.
Two witnesses and the starter.

Again, she must be up to go all the way to even loose her job and involve a lawyer.
A good lawyer will make this case a slam dunk though. They will settle out of court.

Don't let someone like that get away with it.

Carlos.
"A man does not know how alive he can be until a sweet Pinay steals his heart."
my point of view


11/08/2007 - Annulment Process Started
08/21/2008 - Annulment Granted
09/05/2008 - Annulment Court Order Issued
09/10/2008 - Mailed I-129F
09/11/2008 - Arrived at VSC
09/12/2008 - NOA1 Issued
01/29/2009 - NOA2 Issued
02/07/2009 - Manila Case Number Letter Received from NVC
02/15/2009 - Interview Scheduled for March, 23rd 2009
03/02/2009 - Passed Medical
03/23/2009 - Interview, all went well but NBI Clearance on her Married Name was missing
03/25/2009 - Delivered NBI Clearance to US Embassy
04/17/2009 - Visa on hand
04/24/2009 - CFO done
05/13/2009 - Arrived in US
06/01/2009 - Applied for SSN
06/02/2009 - Pending Immunizations done
06/05/2009 - Received SSN
06/22/2009 - Got Married "downtown" style
06/27/2009 - Requested sealed envelop with immunization form from Civil Dr.
07/03/2009 - Received sealed envelop from Dr.
07/14/2009 - Mailed the AOS
07/16/2009 - AOS arrived USCIS
07/20/2009 - AOS NOA1 Issued
08/21/2009 - Biometrics at local USCIS Office
09/10/2009 - Received EAD cards
11/17/2009 - AOS interview. Given a favorable decision.
11/27/2009 - Received the GC
10/07/2011 - Mailed the ROC
10/11/2011 - Arrived at VSC
10/18/2011 - ROC NOA Received (contains the 1 year extension)
11/14/2011 - Received ROC Biometrics Appointment Notification
12/09/2011 - ROC Biometrics
07/19/2012 - ROC Approved letter(no interview, even though I forgot to send a copy of the GC)
07/25/2012 - 10 year GC Arrived

#3 John C

John C
  • Senior Member
  • 1,668 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oregon
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • ca

Posted 20 November 2008 - 11:49 PM

QUOTE (bethscott @ Nov 20 2008, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I just want to share with you this incident that happened in our work few days ago. I will just not mention real names and places here for privacy purposes. A lady(alias Gina) from other country(Columbia) learned that somebody in the company she's working was spreading gossip about her...that she told her co-worker that her job when she was still in Columbia was to do "massage and blow job"!!!

Gina's friend(Sandra) was the one who told her about it because Sandra's step-son(Paul) is also working in that same company. Sandra said that her step-son Paul came to their house and asked his Dad and Sandra about Gina's work in Columbia. He said he asked about it cause he heard the gossip from work. So, Sandra informed Gina right away cause she wanted her friend to be aware of the gossip.

So, the following day, Gina asked Paul about it ....and he told her that it's true he heard about it but he just forgot who said it....but Gina didn't believe he forgot who started the gossip. And she wanted so bad to know who's the bottom of that issue cause it's a sexual harassment. Gina reported it to the HR but the HR Manager told her that he don't have ways to trace who really started the gossip..and he advice Gina to just let it go and stop opening the issue again. But Gina is not satisfied and I understand her side.

So, if you were Gina, what will be your reaction or what will you do?


This may seem irrelevant but was that in fact her job in Columbia or anything close to that? These things do exist after all.

I assume the answer is no by the outrage of the woman but just in case it is yes then that would change the entire outlook of your hypothetical question.





#4 bethscott

bethscott
  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:05 AM

QUOTE (John C @ Nov 20 2008, 06:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This may seem irrelevant but was that in fact her job in Columbia or anything close to that? These things do exist after all.

I assume the answer is no by the outrage of the woman but just in case it is yes then that would change the entire outlook of your hypothetical question.


Im pretty sure Gina is not that kind of a woman who will do such thing. She graduated college and I saw her Data Encoder License. Whoever started that gossip don't even know her that much cause there's nobody in that company that came from her country. So, what's their basis? I think the one who started that gossip wants to let her down. Or might be jealous or what..we don't know.
Beth<img src="http://i238.photobuc...clemmns/hi.gif" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />

<a href="http://profiles.frie...r.com/user.php" target="_blank">http://profiles.frie...om/user.php</a>
<a href="http://www.facebook....ns?ref=profile" target="_blank">http://www.facebook....ref=profile</a>

Removing Conditions on Residence

Sept. 07, 2009 - Sent I-751 Application to VSC (Thru USPS Express Mail)
Sept. 17, 2009 - Received I-751 Receipt Notice
Sept. 25, 2009 - Received Biometrics Schedule
Oct. 17, 2009 - Biometrics done
Jan. 07, 2010 - Received RFE Notice
Feb. 03, 2010 - Submitted Additional Evidences
Feb. 26, 2010 - Card Production Notice

<img src="http://i238.photobuc...b3274581ca.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /><img src="http://i238.photobuc.../val2010-1.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />.

#5 zzzlpr

zzzlpr
  • Senior Member
  • 3,843 posts
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ve

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:10 AM

QUOTE (John C @ Nov 20 2008, 06:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This may seem irrelevant but was that in fact her job in Columbia or anything close to that? These things do exist after all.

I assume the answer is no by the outrage of the woman but just in case it is yes then that would change the entire outlook of your hypothetical question.


John,

Even if it was her job back in Colombia, it is her business and not anyones business in her current job.

I have no sympathy to sexual harassment.

Carlos.

ps. For the record the country is Colombia (with "O"), It is a bit offensive to a Colombian using "U".
It is like The Philluppines.
"A man does not know how alive he can be until a sweet Pinay steals his heart."
my point of view


11/08/2007 - Annulment Process Started
08/21/2008 - Annulment Granted
09/05/2008 - Annulment Court Order Issued
09/10/2008 - Mailed I-129F
09/11/2008 - Arrived at VSC
09/12/2008 - NOA1 Issued
01/29/2009 - NOA2 Issued
02/07/2009 - Manila Case Number Letter Received from NVC
02/15/2009 - Interview Scheduled for March, 23rd 2009
03/02/2009 - Passed Medical
03/23/2009 - Interview, all went well but NBI Clearance on her Married Name was missing
03/25/2009 - Delivered NBI Clearance to US Embassy
04/17/2009 - Visa on hand
04/24/2009 - CFO done
05/13/2009 - Arrived in US
06/01/2009 - Applied for SSN
06/02/2009 - Pending Immunizations done
06/05/2009 - Received SSN
06/22/2009 - Got Married "downtown" style
06/27/2009 - Requested sealed envelop with immunization form from Civil Dr.
07/03/2009 - Received sealed envelop from Dr.
07/14/2009 - Mailed the AOS
07/16/2009 - AOS arrived USCIS
07/20/2009 - AOS NOA1 Issued
08/21/2009 - Biometrics at local USCIS Office
09/10/2009 - Received EAD cards
11/17/2009 - AOS interview. Given a favorable decision.
11/27/2009 - Received the GC
10/07/2011 - Mailed the ROC
10/11/2011 - Arrived at VSC
10/18/2011 - ROC NOA Received (contains the 1 year extension)
11/14/2011 - Received ROC Biometrics Appointment Notification
12/09/2011 - ROC Biometrics
07/19/2012 - ROC Approved letter(no interview, even though I forgot to send a copy of the GC)
07/25/2012 - 10 year GC Arrived

#6 Bobolink05

Bobolink05
  • Members
  • 426 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • ne
  • Local Office:Des Moines, IA

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:26 AM

QUOTE (bethscott @ Nov 20 2008, 06:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Im pretty sure Gina is not that kind of a woman who will do such thing. She graduated college and I saw her Data Encoder License. Whoever started that gossip don't even know her that much cause there's nobody in that company that came from her country. So, what's their basis? I think the one who started that gossip wants to let her down. Or might be jealous or what..we don't know.


bethscott - I would be very firm with your friend and let her know to document to the day and time just what has happened to this point. Tell her to keep written records (though do not keep them at work) and one day she may have to file a written complaint to get this to stop and to retain a lawyer if she gets fired from her job over this. She will then need all the evidence she can get.

Carlos and John C are correct in what they are suggesting for different reasons. Just be sure that your friend is aware of the different directions she can take either now or in the future.

Sexual harassment is the a crime in this country particularly in the work place and carries some rather stiff penalties - it will vary some from state to state. Most companies (especially the good ones) have a no tolerance policy and will automatically terminate an employee for sexual harassment.

Again bethscott - you should ask your friend what were the policies she was given when hired - this will be some indication of the companies attitude. No written policy generally means some tolerance, but don't count on it or it may mean that anything goes until someone takes them to court and they receive a large fine.

Please encourage your friend to be very careful and to document everything.
Bobolink05

Love happens, marriage is a full-time occupation

Natural beauty is always the best, in nature and in women.

#7 bethscott

bethscott
  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:39 AM

QUOTE (zzzlpr @ Nov 20 2008, 06:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What kind of business is that? That might be important.
> Did you mean what kind of business we have in that company that we're working for?

I am 100% positive the HR Manager is trying to make it go away.
I bet his superior is on the look out.

>The HR told Gina that he has no way of tracing who's the one started it. I think he didn't even ask Paul who made the gossip..He just told him to stop telling that issue.

This is what I would do. I am not telling her to do it. She might want to involve a lawyer from the beginning.
This is her decision.

I think this is too serious.
> That's what I thought too.

The guy who confirmed the gossip is the key.
Tell her to get a witness, someone that works there that she can trust.
Then go back with this person to talk with the guy who confirmed the gossip and make him confirm again.
If she has a witness from the first time and she can trust this person will confirm then is even better.
>When she talked to Paul, there was another lady with her and that Lady also didn't believe that Paul forgot who was the one starting the gossip.

I would make a written complain to the HR and copy it to his superior and her supervisor.
>So, aside from reporting it to the HR verbally, it's better if she will make a written one? That makes sense i think.

I don't know how serious she is, i.e., if she up to take it to the end.
>I think she really wants to bring this to the Corporate cause she was not satisfied with what the HR manager actions and even bring it to court..I think that's what her husband wants to do.

If she is, like Colombians are, she should mention, when giving the complaint to the HR that if this written complaint does not get the matter resolved. She will have no alternative than involving a lawyer.
The HR manager will freak out.

In the written complaint make sure to tell that the guy confirmed the gossip and the witness can confirm.

However, before the written complaint is filed, I would go back to the guy and say that he will be listed in the complaint and might have to take the heat.
Advise him that he should tell who started, and the written complaint will have him just as a witness.
I am positive he knows or he started himself.
If he knows, he likely will tell you who did it, and the complaint is complete.
Two witnesses and the starter.

Again, she must be up to go all the way to even loose her job and involve a lawyer.
A good lawyer will make this case a slam dunk though. They will settle out of court.

Don't let someone like that get away with it.

Carlos.

Thank you for your very inforamative idea Carlos, I appreciate it. I will print ur reply out and will give this to Gina... Maybe this will serve as a good guide for her in doing the complaint. Right now, she's waiting for her husband cause he's in other state.



Beth<img src="http://i238.photobuc...clemmns/hi.gif" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />

<a href="http://profiles.frie...r.com/user.php" target="_blank">http://profiles.frie...om/user.php</a>
<a href="http://www.facebook....ns?ref=profile" target="_blank">http://www.facebook....ref=profile</a>

Removing Conditions on Residence

Sept. 07, 2009 - Sent I-751 Application to VSC (Thru USPS Express Mail)
Sept. 17, 2009 - Received I-751 Receipt Notice
Sept. 25, 2009 - Received Biometrics Schedule
Oct. 17, 2009 - Biometrics done
Jan. 07, 2010 - Received RFE Notice
Feb. 03, 2010 - Submitted Additional Evidences
Feb. 26, 2010 - Card Production Notice

<img src="http://i238.photobuc...b3274581ca.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /><img src="http://i238.photobuc.../val2010-1.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />.

#8 bethscott

bethscott
  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:45 AM

QUOTE (zzzlpr @ Nov 20 2008, 07:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
John,

Even if it was her job back in Colombia, it is her business and not anyones business in her current job.

I have no sympathy to sexual harassment.

Carlos.

ps. For the record the country is Colombia (with "O"), It is a bit offensive to a Colombian using "U".
It is like The Philluppines.


Thanks for the correction Carlos...i thought it spells with "U".

Beth<img src="http://i238.photobuc...clemmns/hi.gif" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />

<a href="http://profiles.frie...r.com/user.php" target="_blank">http://profiles.frie...om/user.php</a>
<a href="http://www.facebook....ns?ref=profile" target="_blank">http://www.facebook....ref=profile</a>

Removing Conditions on Residence

Sept. 07, 2009 - Sent I-751 Application to VSC (Thru USPS Express Mail)
Sept. 17, 2009 - Received I-751 Receipt Notice
Sept. 25, 2009 - Received Biometrics Schedule
Oct. 17, 2009 - Biometrics done
Jan. 07, 2010 - Received RFE Notice
Feb. 03, 2010 - Submitted Additional Evidences
Feb. 26, 2010 - Card Production Notice

<img src="http://i238.photobuc...b3274581ca.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /><img src="http://i238.photobuc.../val2010-1.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />.

#9 John C

John C
  • Senior Member
  • 1,668 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oregon
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 01:17 AM

QUOTE (zzzlpr @ Nov 20 2008, 04:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
John,

Even if it was her job back in Colombia, it is her business and not anyones business in her current job.

I have no sympathy to sexual harassment.

Carlos.


My point was that if in fact somehow there was truth to it then it is not sexual harassment. At least not to a rational mind. Whether something is "any one's business at her current workplace or not" does not constitute criminal behavior.

I have also little tolerance for sexual harassment, but even less for the ever expanding judicial and their liberal definitions to criminalize normal human behavior (passing along "juicy" gossip in this example). If someone did something for a living and someone else found out about it and told another person it is not slander or harassment. It is just ordinary gossip which is not a crime. It's a fine line but distinguishable.

Nowadays it seems we are looking for sexual harassment or a child molester behind every bush.

Please don't anyone think I am judging what may or may not be the case of the truth of the rumor in the OP's question. Just expanding on what I said before. It's all hypothetical at this point.

This woman can pursue it to the highest court if she likes. I personally doubt she will end up any better off for it. If she can find out who actually started the rumor but can't prove it she can handle it the old fashioned way. Remember the days when we could fight our own battles? Before we sued at the drop of a hat and expected our government to take care of everything for us? Yes people often had hurt feelings for a while but IMO life was more livable overall.





#10 zzzlpr

zzzlpr
  • Senior Member
  • 3,843 posts
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ve

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:06 AM

QUOTE (bethscott @ Nov 20 2008, 07:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What kind of business is that? That might be important.
> Did you mean what kind of business we have in that company that we're working for?

YES, retail?! restaurant?1 etc...

>The HR told Gina that he has no way of tracing who's the one started it. I think he didn't even ask Paul who made the gossip..He just told him to stop telling that issue.

He is just trying to get rid of her. If Paul can not come up with the source, he will be seen as the source. The reason the HR did not give too much importance too is that it was not a formal complaint.


>When she talked to Paul, there was another lady with her and that Lady also didn't believe that Paul forgot who was the one starting the gossip.

This woman must be trustful. People have the inclination to change their mind when confronted. Unless is in front of a judge.

>I think she really wants to bring this to the Corporate cause she was not satisfied with what the HR manager actions and even bring it to court..I think that's what her husband wants to do.

If she is a real Colombian, I am not surprised




John,

I am with you 100% regarding the litigious country we live.
A fender bender can ruin one's life.

Maybe is the difference of being born in a different country.
No matter what there is always some kind of stigma following this fact.
One thing is people thinking we live in a jungle (the closest jungle to my hometown is 3+ hours flying).
Another that you are what the gossip is bringing upon to her.

Trust me, if she does not confront it, people will believe it is not a gossip.
The next step is "right in her face" jokes, depending where she works.

Also, P. me O. that the manager brushed her off.
I am positive if he had sent a message to all that this is not going to be tolerated, she would walk away happy, the gossip would stop and no more harm.
He chose to once more treat her like a lot of foreigners are treated.

If this was with my pinay I would do exactly what I said. Wouldn't you?

Peace,

Carlos.

"A man does not know how alive he can be until a sweet Pinay steals his heart."
my point of view


11/08/2007 - Annulment Process Started
08/21/2008 - Annulment Granted
09/05/2008 - Annulment Court Order Issued
09/10/2008 - Mailed I-129F
09/11/2008 - Arrived at VSC
09/12/2008 - NOA1 Issued
01/29/2009 - NOA2 Issued
02/07/2009 - Manila Case Number Letter Received from NVC
02/15/2009 - Interview Scheduled for March, 23rd 2009
03/02/2009 - Passed Medical
03/23/2009 - Interview, all went well but NBI Clearance on her Married Name was missing
03/25/2009 - Delivered NBI Clearance to US Embassy
04/17/2009 - Visa on hand
04/24/2009 - CFO done
05/13/2009 - Arrived in US
06/01/2009 - Applied for SSN
06/02/2009 - Pending Immunizations done
06/05/2009 - Received SSN
06/22/2009 - Got Married "downtown" style
06/27/2009 - Requested sealed envelop with immunization form from Civil Dr.
07/03/2009 - Received sealed envelop from Dr.
07/14/2009 - Mailed the AOS
07/16/2009 - AOS arrived USCIS
07/20/2009 - AOS NOA1 Issued
08/21/2009 - Biometrics at local USCIS Office
09/10/2009 - Received EAD cards
11/17/2009 - AOS interview. Given a favorable decision.
11/27/2009 - Received the GC
10/07/2011 - Mailed the ROC
10/11/2011 - Arrived at VSC
10/18/2011 - ROC NOA Received (contains the 1 year extension)
11/14/2011 - Received ROC Biometrics Appointment Notification
12/09/2011 - ROC Biometrics
07/19/2012 - ROC Approved letter(no interview, even though I forgot to send a copy of the GC)
07/25/2012 - 10 year GC Arrived

#11 bethscott

bethscott
  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:20 AM

QUOTE (John C @ Nov 20 2008, 08:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My point was that if in fact somehow there was truth to it then it is not sexual harassment. At least not to a rational mind. Whether something is "any one's business at her current workplace or not" does not constitute criminal behavior.

I have also little tolerance for sexual harassment, but even less for the ever expanding judicial and their liberal definitions to criminalize normal human behavior (passing along "juicy" gossip in this example). If someone did something for a living and someone else found out about it and told another person it is not slander or harassment. It is just ordinary gossip which is not a crime. It's a fine line but distinguishable.
What is sexual harassment?

Sexual harassment does not have to do with personal, private relationships. It happens when a person introduces a sexual element into the academic setting and thereby intimidates, coerces, or humiliates someone because of gender or sexual preference. It is a breach of the trust that exists among members of the academic community. It can occur between individuals of different sexes or the same sex, and between persons of all ages. It can involve supervisor and employee, faculty member and student, fellow employees, or fellow students. Sexual harassment creates confusion because it blurs the boundary between professional roles and personal relationships. The harasser introduces a sexual element into what should be a collegial situation.


Nowadays it seems we are looking for sexual harassment or a child molester behind every bush.

Please don't anyone think I am judging what may or may not be the case of the truth of the rumor in the OP's question. Just expanding on what I said before. It's all hypothetical at this point.

This woman can pursue it to the highest court if she likes. I personally doubt she will end up any better off for it. If she can find out who actually started the rumor but can't prove it she can handle it the old fashioned way. Remember the days when we could fight our own battles? Before we sued at the drop of a hat and expected our government to take care of everything for us? Yes people often had hurt feelings for a while but IMO life was more livable overall.


Beth<img src="http://i238.photobuc...clemmns/hi.gif" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />

<a href="http://profiles.frie...r.com/user.php" target="_blank">http://profiles.frie...om/user.php</a>
<a href="http://www.facebook....ns?ref=profile" target="_blank">http://www.facebook....ref=profile</a>

Removing Conditions on Residence

Sept. 07, 2009 - Sent I-751 Application to VSC (Thru USPS Express Mail)
Sept. 17, 2009 - Received I-751 Receipt Notice
Sept. 25, 2009 - Received Biometrics Schedule
Oct. 17, 2009 - Biometrics done
Jan. 07, 2010 - Received RFE Notice
Feb. 03, 2010 - Submitted Additional Evidences
Feb. 26, 2010 - Card Production Notice

<img src="http://i238.photobuc...b3274581ca.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /><img src="http://i238.photobuc.../val2010-1.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />.

#12 bethscott

bethscott
  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:31 AM

QUOTE (bethscott @ Nov 20 2008, 07:45 PM)
What kind of business is that? That might be important.
> Did you mean what kind of business we have in that company that we're working for?

YES, retail?! restaurant?1 etc...
>it's a textile company that provides healthcare linens. Our corporate is very strict about sexual harassment issue.

Edited by bethscott, 21 November 2008 - 03:05 AM.

Beth<img src="http://i238.photobuc...clemmns/hi.gif" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />

<a href="http://profiles.frie...r.com/user.php" target="_blank">http://profiles.frie...om/user.php</a>
<a href="http://www.facebook....ns?ref=profile" target="_blank">http://www.facebook....ref=profile</a>

Removing Conditions on Residence

Sept. 07, 2009 - Sent I-751 Application to VSC (Thru USPS Express Mail)
Sept. 17, 2009 - Received I-751 Receipt Notice
Sept. 25, 2009 - Received Biometrics Schedule
Oct. 17, 2009 - Biometrics done
Jan. 07, 2010 - Received RFE Notice
Feb. 03, 2010 - Submitted Additional Evidences
Feb. 26, 2010 - Card Production Notice

<img src="http://i238.photobuc...b3274581ca.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /><img src="http://i238.photobuc.../val2010-1.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />.

#13 MrkGrismer

MrkGrismer
  • Moderators
  • 12,855 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Auburn Hills, MI
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • lo

Posted 21 November 2008 - 01:28 PM

If a company really does have a zero tolerance policy towards sexual harrassment then it shouldn't matter who started the gossip. Anyone repeating it would be subject to disciplinary action.

At the very least reporting such an incident should lead to a demand by management that everyone undergo (or repeat) sexual harrassment training.

If the HR person does nothing, then it should be reported to the HR person's supervisor.

If the company does nothing about it, then the company does not have a zero tolerance policy regarding sexual harrassment.

Federal sexual harrassment information: http://www.eeoc.gov/facts/fs-sex.html

Edited by MrkGrismer, 21 November 2008 - 01:35 PM.

If you believe Modern Sporting Rifles have a legitimate use, please like, share and participate on: https://www.facebook...tamateSportsmen

http://www.uscis.gov...0004718190aRCRD
 

Medical Exams – A caller explained that the civil surgeon who completed the medical exam used the wrong form and then wanted to charge an indigent refugee to reprocess the paperwork on the correct form. What recourse does an applicant have if this occurs?

USCIS Response: Customers should notify the Director of their local office when they have a complaint about a civil surgeon.


#14 zzzlpr

zzzlpr
  • Senior Member
  • 3,843 posts
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ve

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:59 PM


YES, retail?! restaurant?1 etc...
>it's a textile company that provides healthcare linens. Our corporate is very strict about sexual harassment issue.
[/quote]

I asked cause companies with high turn over have more "relaxed" policies. Not in your case.

Mark is right on what he said.

I would just add that if it is really zero tolerance and is written in the company's policy, the HR manager could also be implicated in this process for failing to handle the situation according company's policy.

Again, a good lawyer will make the company pay a huge hansom. If she mentions the word "lawyer", the HR manager will move his "behind" rather quickly, if he has an ounce of smartness, but she needs to send a copies to his and hers supervisors cause he might be really dumb.

I wish her the best,

Carlos
"A man does not know how alive he can be until a sweet Pinay steals his heart."
my point of view


11/08/2007 - Annulment Process Started
08/21/2008 - Annulment Granted
09/05/2008 - Annulment Court Order Issued
09/10/2008 - Mailed I-129F
09/11/2008 - Arrived at VSC
09/12/2008 - NOA1 Issued
01/29/2009 - NOA2 Issued
02/07/2009 - Manila Case Number Letter Received from NVC
02/15/2009 - Interview Scheduled for March, 23rd 2009
03/02/2009 - Passed Medical
03/23/2009 - Interview, all went well but NBI Clearance on her Married Name was missing
03/25/2009 - Delivered NBI Clearance to US Embassy
04/17/2009 - Visa on hand
04/24/2009 - CFO done
05/13/2009 - Arrived in US
06/01/2009 - Applied for SSN
06/02/2009 - Pending Immunizations done
06/05/2009 - Received SSN
06/22/2009 - Got Married "downtown" style
06/27/2009 - Requested sealed envelop with immunization form from Civil Dr.
07/03/2009 - Received sealed envelop from Dr.
07/14/2009 - Mailed the AOS
07/16/2009 - AOS arrived USCIS
07/20/2009 - AOS NOA1 Issued
08/21/2009 - Biometrics at local USCIS Office
09/10/2009 - Received EAD cards
11/17/2009 - AOS interview. Given a favorable decision.
11/27/2009 - Received the GC
10/07/2011 - Mailed the ROC
10/11/2011 - Arrived at VSC
10/18/2011 - ROC NOA Received (contains the 1 year extension)
11/14/2011 - Received ROC Biometrics Appointment Notification
12/09/2011 - ROC Biometrics
07/19/2012 - ROC Approved letter(no interview, even though I forgot to send a copy of the GC)
07/25/2012 - 10 year GC Arrived

#15 Goodguy

Goodguy
  • Senior Member
  • 390 posts
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • em

Posted 21 November 2008 - 04:59 PM

QUOTE (John C @ Nov 20 2008, 08:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My point was that if in fact somehow there was truth to it then it is not sexual harassment. At least not to a rational mind. Whether something is "any one's business at her current workplace or not" does not constitute criminal behavior.

I have also little tolerance for sexual harassment, but even less for the ever expanding judicial and their liberal definitions to criminalize normal human behavior (passing along "juicy" gossip in this example). If someone did something for a living and someone else found out about it and told another person it is not slander or harassment. It is just ordinary gossip which is not a crime. It's a fine line but distinguishable.

Nowadays it seems we are looking for sexual harassment or a child molester behind every bush.

Please don't anyone think I am judging what may or may not be the case of the truth of the rumor in the OP's question. Just expanding on what I said before. It's all hypothetical at this point.

This woman can pursue it to the highest court if she likes. I personally doubt she will end up any better off for it. If she can find out who actually started the rumor but can't prove it she can handle it the old fashioned way. Remember the days when we could fight our own battles? Before we sued at the drop of a hat and expected our government to take care of everything for us? Yes people often had hurt feelings for a while but IMO life was more livable overall.


I have to agree with John on this issue. If companies really had a no tolerance policy people would get fired a lot more. I think again that common sense should be a guide. I believe most people are against sexual harassment as it can be very harmful to a person's health, but the devil is in the details. Did you see the Penn & Teller episode on what consitutes sexual harassment training?


#16 zzzlpr

zzzlpr
  • Senior Member
  • 3,843 posts
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ve

Posted 21 November 2008 - 05:26 PM

QUOTE (Goodguy @ Nov 21 2008, 11:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have to agree with John on this issue. If companies really had a no tolerance policy people would get fired a lot more. I think again that common sense should be a guide. I believe most people are against sexual harassment as it can be very harmful to a person's health, but the devil is in the details. Did you see the Penn & Teller episode on what consitutes sexual harassment training?


In this case there is no detail. This is not like a co-worker inviting another to a date, it is low level harassment.

Don't be offended, but I wonder what would be your reaction if it was your wife? Brush it off?

I work in a zero tolerance place.
It is mandatory for everyone attending a training of what is and what is not harassment.
How one should proceed in a case and what would be the consequences.

I did not see any half measures, they were all clear and reasonable.
Obviously, one can forge a false accusation, but any other policy violation can also be forged, like stealing.
The consequences of false accusations are the same as harassment.

I work here for more than 11 years have not heard anyone being fired for this. We are 500 strong, plus contractors.

Peace,

Carlos.
"A man does not know how alive he can be until a sweet Pinay steals his heart."
my point of view


11/08/2007 - Annulment Process Started
08/21/2008 - Annulment Granted
09/05/2008 - Annulment Court Order Issued
09/10/2008 - Mailed I-129F
09/11/2008 - Arrived at VSC
09/12/2008 - NOA1 Issued
01/29/2009 - NOA2 Issued
02/07/2009 - Manila Case Number Letter Received from NVC
02/15/2009 - Interview Scheduled for March, 23rd 2009
03/02/2009 - Passed Medical
03/23/2009 - Interview, all went well but NBI Clearance on her Married Name was missing
03/25/2009 - Delivered NBI Clearance to US Embassy
04/17/2009 - Visa on hand
04/24/2009 - CFO done
05/13/2009 - Arrived in US
06/01/2009 - Applied for SSN
06/02/2009 - Pending Immunizations done
06/05/2009 - Received SSN
06/22/2009 - Got Married "downtown" style
06/27/2009 - Requested sealed envelop with immunization form from Civil Dr.
07/03/2009 - Received sealed envelop from Dr.
07/14/2009 - Mailed the AOS
07/16/2009 - AOS arrived USCIS
07/20/2009 - AOS NOA1 Issued
08/21/2009 - Biometrics at local USCIS Office
09/10/2009 - Received EAD cards
11/17/2009 - AOS interview. Given a favorable decision.
11/27/2009 - Received the GC
10/07/2011 - Mailed the ROC
10/11/2011 - Arrived at VSC
10/18/2011 - ROC NOA Received (contains the 1 year extension)
11/14/2011 - Received ROC Biometrics Appointment Notification
12/09/2011 - ROC Biometrics
07/19/2012 - ROC Approved letter(no interview, even though I forgot to send a copy of the GC)
07/25/2012 - 10 year GC Arrived

#17 James in Austin Tx

James in Austin Tx
  • Moderators
  • 2,323 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Austin, Tx
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ch

Posted 21 November 2008 - 05:29 PM

I agree with Mark also!!I have worked most of my life in a large corporation and the Sexual harassment policies were super strict almost to the point you dont even look at a woman because you are afraid they will haul you into court : (.. But that said, any company that was "strict" in these regards would not condone any actions like letting it go, etc, and most likely would either publish memo's outlining the policies and penalties or have groups discussions on the issue.

#18 John C

John C
  • Senior Member
  • 1,668 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oregon
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 05:29 PM

QUOTE (zzzlpr @ Nov 21 2008, 06:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Again, a good lawyer will make the company pay a huge hansom. If she mentions the word "lawyer", the HR manager will move his "behind" rather quickly, if he has an ounce of smartness, but she needs to send a copies to his and hers supervisors cause he might be really dumb.

Carlos


Ok so this woman got a job where no one knew her. She's plugging along, doing presumably a good job and getting acquainted with her co workers as people do on the job. Some jackass whom she can't readily identify started a nasty rumor. Someone else confirmed that he had heard the rumor but won't say where he heard if from. But of course he knows darned well where he heard it and probably who started it. And he knows the woman is ))))))) about it. Even by now he has probably gone back to the source, who is likely his friend in some way, and reminded him how serious this stuff can be these days. Things cool off as the woman herself gains friends and respect at work over time and life goes on. Let's face it, even though it was an ugly rumor, most people who either know her or come to know her didn't believe it anyway. After all this was hardly sexual harassment anyway. It was slander perhaps but not sexual harassment. Still inappropriate but hardly the same thing. That's what I meant when I said it's out of control. Everything wants to be sexual harassment these days.

So instead she gets a lawyer to force the guy to say where he heard it so she can "get" the bastard who started the rumor. This is after all her right as a worker here in America. Anyone can sue anyone else and they do every day. But of course the reprimand she was looking for or whatever she had in mind never happens and even if it does the guy gets a warning and then life goes on. But this time life goes on very differently for the woman. In the first scenario she stuck up for herself, dispelled the rumor and made it clear through the grapevine to the perpetrator that she isn't going to put up with that crap. But in the lawyer scenario she spends a bunch of money, is forever known as and treated like the ####/whore from Colombia until she can't take it anymore and finds a new job. They will make her life miserable but much more subversively this go round. I have seen it happen at a place I worked at in the past and It ain't pretty.

The whole purpose of my post is to caution anyone from taking the too easily doled out advice (which I have seen posted above already) to "Get a Lawyer". It's bad advice!!!! DO NOT EVER GET A LAWYER, NEVER EVER!!! for anything which has any other solutions. It won't make your life better or easier.

Here is some training material





#19 zzzlpr

zzzlpr
  • Senior Member
  • 3,843 posts
  • Visa type:K-1
  • ve

Posted 21 November 2008 - 06:20 PM

QUOTE (John C @ Nov 21 2008, 12:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ok so this woman got a job where no one knew her. She's plugging along, doing presumably a good job and getting acquainted with her co workers as people do on the job. Some jackass whom she can't readily identify started a nasty rumor. Someone else confirmed that he had heard the rumor but won't say where he heard if from. But of course he knows darned well where he heard it and probably who started it. And he knows the woman is ))))))) about it. Even by now he has probably gone back to the source, who is likely his friend in some way, and reminded him how serious this stuff can be these days. Things cool off as the woman herself gains friends and respect at work over time and life goes on. Let's face it, even though it was an ugly rumor, most people who either know her or come to know her didn't believe it anyway. After all this was hardly sexual harassment anyway. It was slander perhaps but not sexual harassment. Still inappropriate but hardly the same thing. That's what I meant when I said it's out of control. Everything wants to be sexual harassment these days.


Bro,

I agree is not sexual harassment, but no less serious.
It is already tough for women which are exposed to these situations, is even worse if she is a foreigner. We Brazilians live in the jungle eating monkeys for breakfast and a lot of ignorant individuals, and they are a huge number, believe it.
These ones will believe she is one and the next step is asking for her "extra" services.

This was just mishandling from the HR manager.
If he had called Paul, tell him to point what's the source, get to the source, writing him/her up, notifying all employees of what happened (without names) and that is unacceptable. We had this resolved. He didn't. He did not even talked with Paul.
That's why he makes the big bucks, to do the work in his job description. He didn't, and I bet he didn't cause..guess why? She is a woman or worse a foreigner woman.

QUOTE (John C @ Nov 21 2008, 12:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The whole purpose of my post is to caution anyone from taking the too easily doled out advice (which I have seen posted above already) to "Get a Lawyer". It's bad advice!!!! DO NOT EVER GET A LAWYER, NEVER EVER!!! for anything which has any other solutions. It won't make your life better or easier.


If you read carefully, I suggested a lawyer as a last resort or if she does not want to confront the problem directly, but still want this resolved.
I really doubt she will need more than just leverage by mentioning.

I am 100% with you that we should put the blood sucker lawyers out of business.
However, we still need lawyers in many cases for many reasons, what we don't need is the ones advertising during the afternoon judge shows.

Peace,

Carlos.

ps. I say the same I said to my dear friend Goody. What would you do if was my sis-in-law?
"A man does not know how alive he can be until a sweet Pinay steals his heart."
my point of view


11/08/2007 - Annulment Process Started
08/21/2008 - Annulment Granted
09/05/2008 - Annulment Court Order Issued
09/10/2008 - Mailed I-129F
09/11/2008 - Arrived at VSC
09/12/2008 - NOA1 Issued
01/29/2009 - NOA2 Issued
02/07/2009 - Manila Case Number Letter Received from NVC
02/15/2009 - Interview Scheduled for March, 23rd 2009
03/02/2009 - Passed Medical
03/23/2009 - Interview, all went well but NBI Clearance on her Married Name was missing
03/25/2009 - Delivered NBI Clearance to US Embassy
04/17/2009 - Visa on hand
04/24/2009 - CFO done
05/13/2009 - Arrived in US
06/01/2009 - Applied for SSN
06/02/2009 - Pending Immunizations done
06/05/2009 - Received SSN
06/22/2009 - Got Married "downtown" style
06/27/2009 - Requested sealed envelop with immunization form from Civil Dr.
07/03/2009 - Received sealed envelop from Dr.
07/14/2009 - Mailed the AOS
07/16/2009 - AOS arrived USCIS
07/20/2009 - AOS NOA1 Issued
08/21/2009 - Biometrics at local USCIS Office
09/10/2009 - Received EAD cards
11/17/2009 - AOS interview. Given a favorable decision.
11/27/2009 - Received the GC
10/07/2011 - Mailed the ROC
10/11/2011 - Arrived at VSC
10/18/2011 - ROC NOA Received (contains the 1 year extension)
11/14/2011 - Received ROC Biometrics Appointment Notification
12/09/2011 - ROC Biometrics
07/19/2012 - ROC Approved letter(no interview, even though I forgot to send a copy of the GC)
07/25/2012 - 10 year GC Arrived

#20 John C

John C
  • Senior Member
  • 1,668 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Oregon
  • Visa type:Naturalization, None
  • ca

Posted 21 November 2008 - 06:49 PM

QUOTE (zzzlpr @ Nov 21 2008, 10:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
ps. I say the same I said to my dear friend Goody. What would you do if was my sis-in-law?


You're right. If it was my wife it would be horrible. And I would have no choice but to hire a lawyer in that case.

To get her out of jail and try to settle the guy's medical expenses for genital reattachment laugh.gif








0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users